Fire on Deck to Fire in the Belly: If You Lose Your Passion, You've Lost at Life

Navy veteran Shanon Raab discusses his journey from machinist’s mate to passionate recruiter, in both the Navy and civilian worlds, in our first official episode of Exit Buddy: Veteran Stories to Guide You. Shanon shares how a chance visit to the mall at 17 sparked his military career, how mentoring a shipmate led to his Navy recruiting role, and how a sudden decision to leave the service after 20 years left him facing a daunting civilian transition. He dives into being rejected for jobs as “overqualified,” landing civilian gigs through networking on LinkedIn, and helping veterans find their footing, all while emphasizing the power of TAP classes, tailored resumes, and staying true to your passion to thrive post-service.

Chapters

• 01:18 Shanon's Journey to the Navy
• 04:02 Recruiting Duty and Special Programs Path
• 07:14 Shanon's Unexpected Transition Out of the Military
• 09:23 Common Mistakes in Military Transition
• 11:22 Importance of TAP Classes
• 13:28 Job Application Challenges
• 17:13 Networking for Success
• 20:39 Finding the Right Company Culture
• 22:17 Advice for Federal Contracting Roles
• 25:10 The Importance of Passion in Your Career
• 25:58 Final Thoughts on Military Transition and Mentorship

Key Takeaways

• Check Your Ego: Senior leaders and career lifers, don’t let pride block your transition prep—embrace mentorship and guidance.
• Plan Early and Often: Start transition planning a year out, revisit TAPs, and stay open to new programs like SkillBridge.
• Tailor Your Resume: Beat AI screening by aligning your resume with job descriptions—keywords are your friend.
• Network Like You Mean It: From LinkedIn to veteran networking events, building connections is critical.
• Stay True to Your Passion: As our guest says, “If you lose your passion, you’ve lost at life.” Find what lights your fire and chase it.

Follow us for more veteran stories to guide your transition journey, and text this episode to a fellow service member who’s navigating their exit. Until next time, keep the fire in your belly burning!

Visit us at https://exitbuddy.buzzsprout.com to learn more about the show.

Have feedback or questions for us? Email us at ashleyjones.creative@gmail.com.

Transcript

Kathleen Smith 00:29
Hello everyone, and it's Kathleen. Welcome to Exit Buddy: Veteran Stories to Guide You. We're excited you tuned in to explore the ins and outs of transitioning from military to civilian life.

Rachel Bozeman 00:42
That's right, Kathleen, we sure are. This show is all about supporting the transitioning military community as they prepare to navigate that next chapter. We've got an amazing guest lined up in the studio today to share their journey with us. Don't make them wait. Who is it?

Kathleen Smith 01:00
Well, I'm so excited that we're speaking to a great friend of mine. We're joined with Shanon Raab, a Navy veteran who went from being a machinist’s mate to a passionate recruiter, both in the military and now in the civilian world. Welcome to the show, Shanon. 

Shanon Raab 01:16
Thank you, Kathleen and Rachel.

Rachel Bozeman 01:18
We are so excited that you're here, and I'm so excited that I get to talk to a hero and a recruiter. It is like the perfect combination of amazing there. So super excited, and thanks for being with us today. Shanon, so let's go ahead and start at the beginning. How did a trip to the mall at 17, just a couple years ago, set you up on a path towards the military and future career in recruiting?

Shanon Raab 01:45
Wow. Talk about take me back. It's funny because actually, hopefully my mom's not listening. I actually skipped school that day, and being a bud, me and a buddy decided we were gonna go check out, went to the mall, and we're like, hey, we're gonna go check out the recruiters. And of course, he wanted to check out a couple of different ones. He wanted to check out the Army. And I really wasn't there because I had family members in the Army. I was like, that's not really my forte. I was like, I want to do Air Force. We pulled on the Air Force door. They weren't open, so he got the next choice. He's like, okay, Marines. I was like, okay, well, we'll check them out. And I was just a little bit too much structure for me. I was like, yeah, no, not really where I want to be. I said, okay, I guess it's the Navy. So we walked in there, and I met the recruiter, and we started talking, and we just started cutting it up. And I was like, this guy really seems like he knows what he's doing. He seems like what I want to be. And, you know, so I went down the process and didn't know anything about the Navy. I was like, okay, you know, I'll figure it out. It's boats, right? I was like, yeah, whatever. So I get down there, and I start going through the process. I go to military entrance processing system and everything, and I'm like, okay. And actually, I was so nervous that my blood pressure spiked. So they made me, you know, they said I had white coat disease or whatever. So I had to come back later and do it again. So on the process, I got to know my recruiter more. And I was like, you know, I was like, Manny. I was like, how do I get your job? And he goes, what do you mean? You don't want to do my job? I was like, yeah, dude. I was like, this seems like, you know, the best thing for me, you know, I love helping people. I love talking to people. I think it'd be great for me. And he's like, well, you know, you got to do X, Y, and Z. You got to go first into the Navy, do a certain rating, and then you can, you know, try it out and convert over. I was like, okay, so, you know, I went in there knowing I couldn't do it right away. So I chose become an undesignated fireman, which actually led me into becoming a machinist’s mate. So that's really the story of how it happened. I mean, it was just a very good recruiter that seemed like he knew what he was doing, and it made it seem awesome. And it just seemed like my forte.

Rachel Bozeman 03:44
Love it, and I love stories. So I'm going to ask about another story. Shanon, if you don't mind, if you will humor us in all of the amazing list, I know you're dying to tell it, so now here's your chance. So I know there's a story out there about how you got released to a special program and started that recruiting duty that you were so interested in.

Shanon Raab 04:03
Yeah, of course. So actually, that one brings you back to a really good friend of mine, Adam. When I first met him, I had just got stationed in Ingleside, Texas, on the USS Inchon, and I was just, you know, a third class petty officer, E-4 in the Navy, still a machinist's mate working in cargo weapons elevators. And I met Adam, and we started talking, and he was like, yeah, man, I'm gonna get out the Navy. You know, this isn't for me. Blah, blah, blah. And this is a young kid he had, I think we were, think he was, like, 19 at the time. He had two kids, a wife. And I was like, bro, you don't know what you're doing, you know, you gotta think about this. And, you know, take your time. He's like, well, I don't want to be a machinist's mate anymore. And this is a kid that, like, had won all kinds of awards and done great things in the Navy. I was like, man, you really should think about this. And he's like, yeah, I've thought about it, but it's just not going to be what I want to do. I'm going to go back to Louisiana, and I want to work on cranes and, you know, work over there, off the bay, and do that kind of stuff. And I was like, bro, you could do so much more. And then he told about his thought process of, you know, maybe being in cryptological world and, you know, spooky stuff. And I was like, okay, so I started kind of playing into it and listening to him, and I just kind of helped him along. And then all of a sudden he called me. It's funny because he called me. He's like, hey, Shanon, you at home? And I was like, this is when I was out in Corpus Christi. And he's like, I was like, yeah, I'm home. He's like, I'm gonna stop by. Like, okay, so he stops by the house, and he's like, hey, man, I just wanted to let you know I appreciate everything you did for me. And he said, hey, here's a $50 Best Buy gift card. I'm like, what the heck is this for? And he's like, well, I just got advanced to E-5 and I also got accepted to become a CTR, which is the cryptological field, where he wanted to go in. I was like, wait, you're gonna stay in? He's like, yeah, I'm gonna reenlist and yada yada. I'm like, it's awesome, bro. And then, you know, that was great. So then the next day, I go into the office, and I'm sitting down and drinking my coffee, and then the Master Chief comes over. He's like, Raab, come here. Like, oh, what did I do now, you know, of course, when Master Chief talks to you, start freaking out. I'm like, okay, I go in his office, and he sits down, and he's like, all right, what the hell did you do to convince Wilson to stay? And I was like, I just was honest with him. And he's like, man, I've been trying to get that kid to do that stuff for three years, and he wouldn't move at all. And I was like, I was just honest, you know, listen to what his things were, and, you know, it's just what I'm passionate about. He's like, well, what is it you want to do? And I was like, well, you know, I want to go to special programs and, you know, I want to try out be a recruiter, because it's really what I think I want to do with my career. And he goes, okay, and we actually had the detailers come on board, because we had actually gone through it. We had an explosion on the ship. It caused a fire, and we actually ended up decommissioning the Inchon, so they brought all the detailers on board, and then they released me from being a machinist's mate to go over to special programs, which sent me down the path to become a recruiter. So little long story to get there, but that's how I got there.

Kathleen Smith 06:50
But, you know, it's amazing sometimes being out there and doing what you love to do and just doing it because it's a passion. And then sometimes, you know, sorry to hear about the fire on the ship, but you know, the universe just sort of says we're going to just knock you on the right path. So in our pre-call, you talked about how your military transition just sort of snuck up on you. So when did you start thinking about leaving the military? And then how did you pivot once you decided it was time for you?

Shanon Raab 07:23
Well, that one was actually kind of hard, because, honestly, it wasn't something that was on the radar at all. I had really thought that I was going to go on and continue and, you know, retire probably at 30 or stay until they told me to leave. I had aspirations to do that, and it just, things just started to change. And a lot of the old school mentality that I had been brought up with, you know, leadership styles and things like that that I really hung my hat on were changing, and it was just, I could just see the change on the wall. And I was like, I told my wife, I was like, honey, this just doesn't seem like the right thing. I said, I think it's time. And she goes, you sure? And I'm like, yeah, I think so. And I just, kind of, I kind of did that, but it was kind of a lot. It was very fast. It was a transition that I wasn't expecting. So it was, you know, one of those gut check moments where life just kind of hit me in the head. And I was like, oh, crud, what am I going to do now? You know, had a lot of backlash from the chain of command. They didn't want me to leave. They were like, you're going to make, you know, Senior Chief, you're going to be on the next path. He's like, you're doing great. We don't want to lose you. I was like, it's just time. And you know, everybody I think knows when it's time. They see the writing on the wall when it's time to hang up the cloth of the nation. It's just there. It just kind of showed up. And it was really fast, fast and scary, honestly. Um, you know, I was out in Colorado at the time, and I didn't know anything about, I wanted to go home, but I wasn't sure how I was going to do it. I thought about staying there, just didn't, didn't pan out. I ended up going back home to San Antonio.

Rachel Bozeman 08:57
I love that. We got into recruiting with a fire, got out with a bang. I mean, I'm seeing a theme here, Shanon, I'm liking what you're putting down. And no, I appreciate that. And so a beautiful part of this podcast and this conversation is really about giving back and sharing your experiences with others so that they know what's coming up. So I'm going to ask you, if you don't mind, to share a little bit of your opinion, your thoughts on what are some, maybe some common mistakes that you see service members who are getting ready to make that transition, especially those career lifers. What are some of those common mistakes that you're seeing out there? And do you have a tip for checking your ego at the door?

Shanon Raab 09:37
Yeah, I think that that really is probably the biggest thing. One of the biggest tips is, you know, checking the ego at the door, especially for senior leadership and lifers like myself, when we were in, you know, I was that guy that I'd never thought I was going to get out. So, you know, yeah, I think one of the biggest things is, you know, checking that ego at the door. And also, the next thing is taking a lot of time and actually planning out your transition more and taking advantage of the things that are in place, because, like when I retired, you know, mine was a quick decision. So I hate to say that sometimes you will get stuck in that. I understand life changes, but if you can, it's very important, and I stress this enough to everybody. I even mentor now and talk to that are transitioning. I'm like, look, take advantage of TAPs class, go to the year out, do all the stuff that they tell you, listen to everything, and then go back again before you retire. I said it's very important, because things change in that year period, you know, and new programs come out, new things, new guidelines, all kinds of fun things will come out. And it's important for you to do that. And the biggest thing is, you know, I thought when I retired, I was like, oh yeah, I'll find a job, and no sweat, someone's gonna pick me up. I'll be making lots of money. I'll be happy. No big deal. I got this nothing, and it wasn't the case. I mean, it was especially when I just pulled the trigger and said, I'm out. You know, if it wasn't for Kathleen, I probably wouldn't be sitting here right now, and that's an honest story too.

Kathleen Smith 11:00
Thank you, my dear. I did not know that.

Rachel Bozeman 11:02
And so there's a fire. There was an explosion, and then you had a firecracker that kept you in the path there. So keep this theme up. This is true. This is true. See, I love it. And speaking of themes, you did mention TAPs, not once, but twice, that there should be some engagement with those TAPs classes. So why do you think that's such a critical step?

Shanon Raab 11:24
Well, I think one, you get to see the process of people, not only that, but you get to meet new people that are going through the same transition as you, and also you're able to kind of get mentors and things of that. And there's a lot of things out there that can help you. And you know, I think a lot of things have changed from like when I retired, to now, especially with SkillBridge and that that thing is awesome. If that had happened to be where I was at, I think it would have been a great thing to do, especially since it seems like a lot of talent acquisitions do pick that up. The one thing I would say to my fellow veterans in that aspect is don't plan on that being your next position, because I've seen a lot of people that have gone on SkillBridge, got the experience and been able to network, but they don't end up with that company, which is fine, but they need to keep that in mind, because, you know, it's probably not going to be the company you end up with so but it is a great thing to go through, and I think that's probably a lot of things that they would learn in the TAPs class and be able to find that aspect of things. And if you didn't do it, you know, the year out, you're not going to know about the SkillBridge unless someone told you about it. And you know, you trying to do it, like six months prior to getting out, you're not going to have time to do the SkillBridge. You're not going to have time to take that extra little step and do things. And I've seen a lot of my buddies you know that have done it, and it's been a great, great program for them. But yeah, I think you know that mentorship and plus they preach about the LinkedIn and they preach about the networking. And I have to tell you again, back to Kathleen, if she didn't find me on LinkedIn, I wouldn't be in this path I'm in right now. And that is the truth.

Kathleen Smith 13:03
You know, I'm getting a little misty eyed because I remembered all of this. I was like, oh my gosh, I can't, I can't believe, yeah, that was true. I found you on LinkedIn. And, okay, I'm getting a little bit choked up. I'm gonna get a little bit choked up, and I'm done. I've got to move on and be professional here. So you know you have a lot of experience in recruiting and applying for jobs. So when it comes to applying for jobs, we know people often worry about whether they have enough experience to meet the requirements, but I've heard you've had to reevaluate what jobs you were applying for because you were actually overqualified for them. So can you tell us a little bit more about that and how it did sometimes not work in your favor?

Shanon Raab 13:47
Yeah, of course. So it actually is funny, because one time I had gotten all the way through the hiring process, got in front of the hiring manager, and she was sitting across, you know, of course, it was face to face, and she was sitting across the desk from me, and she finally looked at me and she said, Shanon, I can't hire you. And I'm like, what do you mean? She's like, you're overqualified. She's like, I'm afraid you're gonna end up taking my position. So in I just, I can't, you would run circles around the people in the office, this and that. And I'm like, but look, you don't understand myself. I'm ready to take a back seat. I'm looking for the next thing you know, when all those years of operational commitment and, you know, recruiting and running divisions and multiple, multiple people that are under my control, that stress and everything, that's what I'm used to, it's like, I wanted to take a step back. I was okay with taking a back seat and but she just didn't want to hear it. And I was like, well, that's kind of bad. And then she ended up going on to another company, which is doing great things, but we're actually still friends and still talk every now and then. But, you know, she really made me open my eyes and think about the kind of jobs I was applying for, and really look at the company, look at the job description better, and kind of make sure I tailor my resume more towards that versus, you know, hey, just give me my blanket resume that has all the qualifications and things like that in there, you know, because you got to tailor it to the position you're looking for. And that, again, goes back to somebody on this podcast that used to say that to me all the time. I can't, I don't know who that might have been, but, yeah, but, you know, it brings me to another story. I'm just gonna go the story, because Rachel loves stories. So my friend hit me up the other day, and he's like, Shanon, I've applied for 60 roles, and I can't get a call back or anything. And I'm like, I said, bro, send me your resume. He sends me his resume, and, oh, my lord, Kathleen, I tell you, when he sent me his resume, I about cried. I was like, brother, look, this is not what you need to be sending. First off, I said you're missing so many key points. And I sat there and I had to rewrite his resume. And yes, I do do that a lot for people, especially in my position, but I had to reevaluate it, and then I kind of talked to him a little bit, and I was like, look, brother, you have to tailor this to the position you're applying for. Out of those 60 positions, did you adjust your resume at all? No, and you're wondering why you're not getting a call back, especially in today's environment. So much of talent acquisition is going AI. And I'm not saying it's a good thing, and I'm not saying it's a negative thing, but if you don't have those keywords, that algorithm is not going to pick up your resume. If it's not gonna pick up your resume, you're not gonna get a call back, you're just gonna go in the trash. Now, if you apply to a small company, you may catch somebody like me that's got nothing but time on his hands and doesn't know how to not work all the time. And I'll read through your resume, and maybe I'll figure it out, but if you don't have those keywords, those computer systems aren't going to pick it up. And he's like, are you kidding me? And I'm like, read the job description, tailor your resume, then send it and you'll get some calls back. So that's what I did. See, I listened, Kathleen, I always listen to you. I mean, I did have the military background, but I owe a lot of the change to the civilian sector, to the lady on the podcast.

Rachel Bozeman 17:11
She is amazing, you are correct, and we didn't even pay him to say that, friends, that is a bona fide review.

Kathleen Smith 17:21
I don’t know how much Barbecue I'd have to ship to you to pay for all of that. I know it'd be, you know, tons and tons.

Rachel Bozeman 17:28
I think those are fighting words. Kathleen, a Virginian trying to send a Texan some barbecue. I don't know. I just feel like there's other collateral.

Kathleen Smith 17:39
I'll just send some peanuts.

Rachel Bozeman 17:44
Well, awesome. Well, speaking of cooking, kind of like cooking, is networking, which can sometimes feel pretty intimidating, especially maybe if you're a little more introverted or starting from scratch in a new location. So what's your advice for veterans on how to start building those connections?

Shanon Raab 18:04
Well, my biggest advice is, get out of your comfort zone. You have to, it's kind of like what I'm doing now. I don't like doing this. This isn't something I enjoy. But somebody on here again, told me, you know, you'll be fine, and she knows what she's doing, so I'm gonna go with it.

Kathleen Smith 18:16
I told you it would be fine on a podcast. You know, I knew you didn't want to do it, but you’re doing great.

Shanon Raab 18:23
And that's the thing. You just got to get out of your comfort zone. And even in recruiting, on the military side, it's all about networking. It's all about building, you know, your crop, your people to talk to. You always have to do that. You got to cast your net. And it's the same thing in this, you're now, you're selling yourself to the next person to be able to get your next, you know, role in life, and it's so important. I think if you're very introverted, I think look for those. I know there's like veteran beer clubs that are out there. There's all kinds of other things. I know here in San Antonio, they have some, I think there was the other one, Bourbon Biz. I mean, there's all kinds of things to allow you to release your inhibitions, to kind of be able to go and do that in a more relaxed environment. Try that.

Kathleen Smith 19:08
So as a follow up to that, you landed your current role by sharing someone's job posting. So can you tell us how networking led to that job opportunity?

Shanon Raab 19:16
Yeah, yeah. So you know, I was sitting there, and I was going through LinkedIn, of course, like I always do, and I was just looking for different people and different posts. And I saw something from my current employer, and you know, he's a retired Navy captain, and I saw that he had a need for a recruiter. And I was like, hey. I was like, Dan, is this a remote position? Because I was going to post it on my LinkedIn for you. And he goes, well, Chief, why are you interested? And I was like, well, you know, I wasn't looking, but, you know, I always listen to something, you know, that you're pitching. So I got a call with him, and he started talking to me, and then we just kind of went down the road. And I was like, you know what, this sounds like something I could do. And I was like, you know, I know I can do the position. I know I can do the job. I know I can help people. And I thought, like it would help me more, to give back to the community that I wanted to, you know, to help, and that's how it worked out. I didn't understand that it was going to happen that way. But again, LinkedIn got me a second position, and I know maybe I need to get sponsored by them, because I'm a two-time hero, but I can't say it enough. I mean, keeping that thing updated and building your network. It's important. It really does help.

Kathleen Smith 20:24
It does and keeping it updated, I can tell you that a lot of people don't keep it updated. So I've heard, I've heard you say that the military instills a no-fail mindset. How has that, along with your other skills, guided you in your work in the civilian sector?

Shanon Raab 20:42
I think, like, especially in, like, recruiting, it definitely does a lot. Because I might work, you know, several hours during the day, and then I'll go have dinner with the family and, you know, relax for a little bit, but I'll come back to work and I'll finish up my job for the day. I mean, I might sit in my office for a couple hours at like, eight, nine, ten o'clock at night, you know, reading through resumes and doing things because, you know, if I have a position to fill, I'm going to try to do everything I can to fill it as fast as I can, and take care of people. And then it's kind of funny, because in the military, it's just, it's not an option in the military. So for us, it's like, we don't understand how to stop and end. If it's got to get completed, we're going to complete it. It's like, you know, kind of the analogy, you know, put a square peg into a round hole. You can't do it. But in the military, you don't have a choice. You got to figure out how to make it work and make it happen. And that's just what we do. And I think bringing that especially to, you know, recruiting and some other positions, it would work. But I could see, you know, I had another buddy that was an engineer, and he's like, it's different, you know, we don't get a project out on time, but we quit at five o'clock period. We'll just bill the customer more later. It's just, I don't understand that mindset because of the 20 years in service. So, yeah, I mean, I think that's where it really helps, you know, to get things done. Because you give me the opportunity to go get a job done. I'm gonna go get it done. It's just the way it is.

Rachel Bozeman 22:04
That's the way it is. And speaking of the way it is, question for you, so for our friends out there, those veterans that are targeting those federal contracting and government roles, are there top tips you have for standing out as a candidate in that arena?

Shanon Raab 22:20
I think, honestly, know who you're applying for. I think doing the research on, like, the companies themselves and knowing what you're looking for. I think a lot of us, we get stuck in the stigma when we retire. We're like, oh, I want to go work for the big Fortune 500 companies, or the big, you know, this and that. And I've heard so many unhappy stories of people in there, where they're just treated like a number, and it's, that's not what we're used to, as far as, like the military, we're used to this family-oriented, you know, team cohesiveness. If you're looking for something like that, I think you need to do the research on the company. Look for something that's more family-based, kind of military-owned, something of that nature, something that's going to, you know, really help you continue to grow. I mean, I've been lucky to work both companies that I work for after transitioning. Were both that way, and I would never, I will say it again and again. I will never, ever go away from that, because to me, it's just where I fit. It's where I thrive. I think knowing yourself and knowing what you'll do best at is probably a good tip as well. I just think researching the companies and researching their philosophies, their bottom line, what they stand for, I think that's important for you to look at.

Kathleen Smith 23:33
So another thing that we always talk about is culture fit. And some statistic that I love pulling out all the time is that from the Department of Labor, there are these statistics that have stayed tried and true throughout the decades, that more than 80% of veterans actually move from one job to another one year out of their transition out of the military service, and the number one reason is culture fit. So I believe that you've done some research on how veteran-friendly a company is. Do you want to share that so people can have sort of this how to evaluate a culture fit?

Shanon Raab 24:13
I think one of the things that you can do again is go back to, like, LinkedIn. Look at their profile, look at, is the person in charge, or is the CEO or people work there? How many veterans are there? I know that's important, because, you know, it doesn't matter the branch of service. I mean, we all love each other. It's the same thing. I mean, yeah, we may razz each other from time to time, but that's just the way it is. And we're used to that type of culture. I think if you look at that, see, like, again, more about the history of the company and see what they're really based about. I think that's really going to give you a good indication, okay, they have a lot of veterans. Yes, okay, is the, is the upper chain of command? You know, is that more of a veteran-type style? I think those are great things to look at. I just really, I really feel like we need that type of, still, that culture of the small-time company. Now, you're not going to find that in the Fortune 500 companies, because they just don't got the time. To them, they've got thousands of people. Unless that's something that works for you, go for it. But I think that dialing down and looking at, you know, a lot of these companies say that they are veteran-friendly. I think a lot of that's changed from, like, when I retired back in 2017 when I started looking, a lot of these companies just use that as, like, a tagline, just to try to get people, and then when you really look back and peel the onion, you're like, there's not many veterans that are on here. There's not many vets that are actually working at this company. So, you know, that don't seem like the culture fit that I'm looking for.

Kathleen Smith 25:40
So in your pre-call, you compared military transition to parents watching their kids grow up. Everyone warns you it's fast, but you don't feel the gravity of it until you're in it. So hindsight 20/20, if you could stop the time machine and give your transitioning self one piece of advice, what would that be?

Shanon Raab 26:00
I think that would be myself. Would be to listen to all the hype that I was told about transitioning, take it all in, find a mentor, find the person to help me, to guide me through the process, versus just jumping in with both feet and hoping for the best. Because that's not really the plan and I really believe that we have changed over the, wow, it's been a while since I retired, since that period of time, because, you know, I get to talk to these kids now, when they're transitioning and the young generation, oh, man, they got their stuff on point, those kids, they pay attention, they listen, they take advantage of the documentation is put out there. All the guidance is put out there. It's us old salts that think we know everything. So I think we really have to, again, check your ego at the door, pay attention to what you're looking at, take advantage of what's out there, because I guarantee it would make it a lot smoother of a transition and find somebody, find a mentor, find somebody that just went through it. And I think also finding somebody that went through it like a few years later than that person, will help you as well, because you can compare the differences. Things are different. Like I've said 100 times, my story was crazy. It was, it was the scariest thing I ever did, besides having a child and not know what I was doing. I mean, it was, it was the scariest thing I ever did. And, you know, I was very lucky along the way that, you know, it worked out, and someone found me. And I think finding a mentor, keeping those things up to date, listening to what they got to say, is so much what I would have done differently. Yeah, that's how I feel about it. That's probably what I would tell my younger self.

Kathleen Smith 27:42
Just a follow-up question on that, you had a passion, and before you got into the, well, just as you were getting into the military in recruiting, and then you went through a variety of different career twists and turns in the military, and then all of a sudden you came back to being a recruiter. So you had a passion, and even though you sort of went on this windy road of your career, you were able to come back to your passion. Would you be able to tell your younger self, don't worry, keep your passion. You'll be able to follow it. Because I think that that's one thing I see a lot of transitioning veterans do. They're like, I really like doing this one thing, but it doesn't look like I'll find it out there in the civilian world.

Shanon Raab 28:33
Yeah, I think you have to be true to yourself. I think your passion really drives you, go for it. I mean, you know, my father always told me when I was younger, he's like, Shanon, you know, it ain't about making a million dollars. It sounds great, but he said, if you're not happy doing it, what's the money gonna do for you? You know, it's not gonna do anything. You're just gonna keep working for the money. And, you know, I tell my boys the same thing, you know, it's funny because, like, my boys are and it is kind of off-topic, because it's not military veteran, but my boys are into construction, and they love doing that kind of work. And my wife is like, no, they need to go to college. And you do this and you do that. And I'm like, honey, there are too many blue-collar people out there that aren't going to be able to do this. They're not going to be able to build homes. They're not, AI can't take over that kind of stuff. Sorry, it's not going to happen. I said, eventually this is going to be the new doctor or lawyer. And, you know, people, and I'm like, that's their passion. They enjoy working with their hands. I understand that because, you know, I am a woodworker on the side. So I enjoy doing that. I enjoy doing this as well. I'm getting older. This passion is more my forte than considering going out in the hot, 100-degree weather and doing what my boys do, I get what they're doing. You know, you gotta stick with your passion, because then you're not really working a day in your life. You're enjoying it. You're just able to help people, and you're able to, you know, at the end of the day, when we go to the pearly gates, we're able to say, hey, I did my way. I lived my passion. I was able to do what I wanted to do, and I did it the right way. I mean, I got to help people along the way. I, you know, I've done a lot of great things helping people. You know, I get calls from people still today. You know, I helped a Marine find a position as she was getting out, she's a single mom, and she was scared, and now she's sending me her certificates from, you know, best worker, or whatever she just got. And she's like, hey, Chief, look what I did. Not bad for a Marine, huh? I mean, I'm like, you know, those are, those are stories I enjoy. I mean, that's what I do this for. It's not for the paycheck, it's for that. It's to help people along the way, to make their transition easier than mine was, especially and yes, of course, I do find the government employee that has retired or took, you know, in the certain situation, they're like, hey, I'm not ready to retire. But I took it because I thought I was and now, can you help me get back on the contractor side? But, I mean, it's, that's what I love doing. I love those stories. To me, that's, that's all the wealth in the world. It's not like I work a day in my life. I mean, honestly, I don't, I get to work from home and do what I do and talk to great people. And you know, it's just my passion is there. And I think if you lose your passion, you've lost at life. Honestly, I think you need to pay attention and go do what you need to do and stick with it.

Kathleen Smith 31:14
Awesome. Shanon, always great to see you. Thanks for sharing the story, and thank you for ruining my mascara by making me cry so much.

Shanon Raab 31:21
You're welcome, at least I was honest.

Kathleen Smith 31:29
It was so great to see my friend Shanon, and he made so many good points. You know, once I get over being all choked up, I'll figure out them all. But I really liked how he leveraged LinkedIn. I mean, yeah, I found him on LinkedIn and he's been leveraging that, and he does such a great job. So key point, keep your LinkedIn updated. Rachel, what did you love?

Rachel Bozeman 31:51
Yes, I think that was so good. And yes, I loved watching him talk about the importance of making those connections and that networking, investing and listening to that other human being on the other side of that conversation, because that may be the very person that is going to be the launch pad for your career and continue to help you throughout your career. Well, friends, this is it, the very end, and you've made it here. So be sure to follow us. Text this episode to a fellow exit buddy, take care, and until next time, toodles!